Becoming Family-The Challenges and Triumphs of Adoptive Parenting

Aubree Henderson: 00:00:00

Most of them eventually transitioned to wanting

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to call us mom, usually, I think,

because they hear the other kids call

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us mom, but that's a big milestone.

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We just had that with

one of our kids today.

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I dropped him off at school and he

pointed to me and this is a kid who

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normally I dropped him off at school and

he cannot like get me out the door fast

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enough, like does not want to say bye.

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And he's he pointed to me Talking to

his friend and said, that's my mom.

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Tony Tidbit: We'll discuss race and how it

plays a factor and how we didn't even talk

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about this topic because we were afraid.

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BEP Narrator: A black

executive perspective.

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Tony Tidbit: Welcome to a black executive

perspective podcast, a safe space where

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we discuss all matters related to race,

especially race in corporate America.

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I'm your host Tony Tidbit.

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So before we get started today, we

wanted to send out a friendly reminder

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for you to make sure you check out

our partners Code M Magazine, whose

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mission is saving the black family

by first saving the black man.

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So definitely go check

them codemmagazine.com.

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That is codemagazine.com.

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So we also want you to check out today.

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Today we're gonna navigate the

layer and gratifying journey.

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of adoption.

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I'm accompanied by three inspiring

individuals, a single black woman and

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a same sex couple who are here to share

their unique stories and experiences.

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We'll discuss the motivations behind their

decisions, the challenges they face from

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navigating legal hurdles to overcoming

societal prejudice, and how adopting a

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child has forever changed their lives.

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Change their worlds.

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So Dr.

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Nsenga Burton, Aubree and Laura

Henderson, welcome to a Black Executive

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Perspective Podcast, my sisters.

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Dr. Nsenga Burton: Thank you.

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Tony Tidbit: Hey, I'm glad you're here.

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Thank you for really wanting to

participate and share this story.

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This is National Adoption Month in

November, so this is very important

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to a Black executive perspective.

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We want to hear your perspectives on

adoption, the good, the bad, and ugly, and

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more importantly, educate the audience on

why adoption Is there is something that

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they definitely should consider because

there are so many kids that are looking

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for love and they're looking for a home.

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So we definitely want to dive into it.

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But before we get into

the heavy stuff, ladies.

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Why don't you all go around and tell us

a little bit about where you're currently

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residing and the makeup of your family.

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So we'll start with Dr.

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Burton first.

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Dr. Nsenga Burton: Hi, so I am currently

living in Atlanta, uh, Atlanta, Georgia.

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I was thinking of my home

state, Atlanta, Georgia.

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I am the mother of an eight year old Kai,

which I'm sure many of you who follow me

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know about because I talk about her a lot.

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Uh, I have, uh, Had her

since she was six hours old.

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So I adopted her.

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Um, and I will say I'm an only parent.

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Um, you know, uh, there is no dad.

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I am both parents.

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There is no partner currently.

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So, uh, it's just me.

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Uh, and I'm not from Atlanta,

so I, my family is elsewhere.

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Uh, so I really have, uh, The bulk

of the care of Chi, although I have

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created an amazing village that helps me

tremendously with her care and upbringing.

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Tony Tidbit: That is awesome.

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We can't, I mean, we want to dive

into that village and your story, so

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I'm looking forward to hearing it.

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The Hendersons, Laura,

Aubree, jump in here.

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Tell us a little bit, where are you

currently residing and tell us about

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the makeup of your beautiful family.

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Aubree Henderson: Okay, cool.

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I'll start.

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I was, I'm like looking at

Laura, like you want to go?

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Yeah, yeah.

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Who's going to start?

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Um, so hello, my name is Aubree Henderson.

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I'm, I'm half of this couple.

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My wife, Laura and I live

in Brooklyn, New York.

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Um, and currently we have

4 kiddos in our home.

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We're a foster home.

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So we have some of our 1 of our

children we've adopted from foster care.

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And then the other 3 still

currently are in care.

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So we have not adopted them,

but we are an adoptive home.

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So.

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You know, we always say that

we are going to be the adoptive

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home for our kids if they're not

able to be reunified with family.

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So currently four kids in our home.

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Our oldest is 13.

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We've adopted him.

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Um, and then we have a 10 year old,

a nine year old and an 18 month old.

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Tony Tidbit: Wow.

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Wow.

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Look at you guys.

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So when you jump in,

you jump in all the way.

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That's right.

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That's right.

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I mean, no, no dipping the

toe in the water, right?

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We're going to do it.

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We're going to do it.

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That's right.

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All right.

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I love that.

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I love that.

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That is awesome.

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So welcome.

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So, you know, Laura, I'm

going to start with you here.

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You know, obviously.

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We don't know, the mainstream of

people don't know a lot about adoption.

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Um, you know, we see things on TV of

somebody carrying a baby or, or whether

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the case may be from international.

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And we just don't really

understand it, right?

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And, you know, for you guys to come

on to share, because there's a lot

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of things that, You know, most people

probably wouldn't want to share

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when it comes to what they have to

go through to adopt a child, right?

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So the question I have for you,

why did you and Aubree want to come

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on a Black Executive Perspective

podcast to talk about this topic?

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Laura Henderson: Well, thank you for the

question and thanks so much for having us.

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You know, we're thrilled to be invited

into this conversation because,

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of course, adoption Is a chance to

expand love in your family and love

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is certainly a core value for AJ.

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I call Aubree AJ and for AJ and I

and, you know, as members of the

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queer community, we believe in chosen

family and so many folks who are

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queer, you know, we have choices for

how we build family and for us, it

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was like, are we going to have that?

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Some are we gonna get some, you

know, to put it in crude terms.

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And, uh, and, you know, we've

through this journey of foster care.

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We've learned so much.

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We've grown so much.

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And so to get to share our experience,

particularly in a space that.

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Is, uh, you know, about a black

perspective that that has a

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racial lens is really mean for

us as white parents as well.

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So, um, we've had, we're transracial

foster and adoptive parents.

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Our kids do not look like us and, um,

that has been a really meaningful,

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important part of our journey as well.

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So we're really.

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Um, excited to be here

and talk about that.

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Tony Tidbit: That is awesome.

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Aubree, anything you wanted to

add to that or are you good?

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Aubree Henderson: No, I'm good.

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She put it well.

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Tony Tidbit: Okay, awesome.

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Dr.

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Burton, tell us, why did you want to

come on the Black Executive Perspective

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Podcast to talk about this topic?

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Dr. Nsenga Burton: Well,

A, you invited me, Tony.

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Tony Tidbit: That definitely

has to have something to do with

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Dr. Nsenga Burton: it, Uh, be,

uh, November is, uh, adoption,

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National Adoption Awareness Month.

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And so I always like to do

some type of programming around

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that, um, leading up to it.

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And so October is an important, um, time.

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And I know that November, we

have a big election coming up.

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So.

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So, um, there's probably gonna be

less adoption programming this month,

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um, coming month because of that.

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So I wanted to make sure that I

came on and, um, let people know

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that adoption is a fantastic option.

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It is something that is needed,

especially if you're talking about

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children, African American children.

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You know, and if you're thinking about

the foster care system, they're great

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people like the Henderson's here who are

doing amazing work within that system.

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There's a lot that needs to be done.

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And there are a lot of kids

who actually need help.

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They need support.

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They need positive home environment.

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They need loving.

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And nurturing and kind parents,

people who have empathy, people

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are going to be nice to them.

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And so I think it's important to come

on to really talk about these issues

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and to really impart the importance of

considering adoption if you are healthy.

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If you are happy and if you're

financially able, um, then I think,

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and mentally stable, um, and I'm not

talking about like anxiety, depression,

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all this stuff that everybody has.

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I'm not talking about that, but

mentally stay emotionally whole.

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Um, then I think you should

really consider having a child

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Tony Tidbit: or listen, I have

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Dr. Nsenga Burton: adopting a child,

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Tony Tidbit: adopting a child.

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Well, listen, I, number one, I thank you

for again, uh, participating to share

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your stories and so let's you guys ready.

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It seems like everybody's

chomping at the bit.

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You guys ready to talk about it.

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Laura Henderson: So let's talk about

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Tony Tidbit: it.

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Right?

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So let's I'm gonna start

with the Henderson's first.

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You know, listen, talk, you know, and

you said a little bit of it, but I

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love to dive in a little bit deeper.

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What inspired both for

you to pursue adoption?

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All right.

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And then more importantly, how did you

know it was the right path for what

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you guys wanted to do as a family?

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Aubree Henderson: Okay.

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I can start.

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Um, and then Laura, you can add,

certainly if I miss things, I

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think, you know, when we, uh,

Decided we wanted to start a family.

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We both had kind of experiences

from our upbringing that.

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Had exposed us a little bit

to foster care to adoption.

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Um, my mom, when I moved out and went to

college, I was the oldest of four kids

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and my mom, uh, fostered and adopted

two more kiddos through foster care.

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Um, after I moved out once

I was out of the home.

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So I wasn't living at home when

that happened, but obviously it's,

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that's happening within my family.

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I was very much kind of aware of

the process and it really felt

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like something to me that was

like, Oh, this is a way we could.

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Build a family, um, and for Laura, she had

exposure to that through her dad working

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in family court and, you know, kind of

having that experience through the legal

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system and being aware of kind of how

those things go from that lens, which I'm

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sure she can talk about a little bit more.

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But for both of us, it was.

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You know, it was 1 way that we could

imagine starting a family, and it's

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just what we decided to go for.

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And like you said earlier, once we decide

to do something, we do it all the way.

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And so, um, you know, we've gone

from, you know, You know, initially,

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starting out with 2 kiddos in our

home and kind of having a number

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of kids come through our home.

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Some of them to reunify with family.

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Some of them still with us are,

you know, our daughter is who's

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been with us the longest we met her

and she moved in with us in: 2018

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when she was 3 and she's 10 now.

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And so, you know, we, we both had

that kind of exposure early on.

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And I think we decided this

was the route we wanted to go.

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We also had a friend who works in

mental health, um, in with kids in

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foster care specifically, and with

families and foster care and knew us

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and said, you know, I think I think

you guys could be really helpful.

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Great for this.

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I think you could be a good fit.

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It's, it's hard, but it's worth it

and we need awesome foster parents.

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And so we decided to check it out and

now it's kind of, for me, it's like

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my central life's work at this point.

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Um, and I'd say for Laura in a big

way too, it's, it's kind of, she

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always says it's the best thing we

feel like we could be doing with our

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time and energy is loving on our kids.

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Tony Tidbit: That is awesome.

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I love it.

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I love it.

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And what I'm hearing, there was some

familiarity in terms of, because as

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you were saying, Aubree, your mother

had taken in a couple of kids, right?

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And then Laura, your father, from a court

standpoint, from a legal standpoint,

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you understand the process and you've

still, so this wasn't like unfamiliar

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in terms of like, we don't know what to

do, what a case may, is that correct?

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Laura Henderson: That's correct.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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You know, we.

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We kind of knew a little bit about the

system, and we knew, um, more about kind

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of the background of the kids, right?

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And I think a lot of people, when

they're thinking about adopting

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through foster care, there's like

some fear that pops up, like, what if

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these kids are not okay, or whatever.

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And, uh, And I've got to tell you,

like, the kids are the best part.

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The kids are the joy.

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It's, it's the adult grown up stuff

of foster care that's the worst and

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emotionally hard and all of that.

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But the kids are the bright light, and I

think, you know, we both were able to see

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that, you know, whatever the stigma might

be about kids who need help or in care,

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um, Every kid just wants to be loved.

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Every kid just wants to be seen.

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Right.

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And there is this need out there in

a very broken system that, you know,

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targets and polices certain communities

for folks who want to show up just

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to be there to lift others up and to

be supportive of biological families

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as a whole, not just the kids.

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So we both felt like, That's

something we could do and we

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could make kind of a life calling.

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Um, and, and it's been a joy.

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It's been awesome.

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Tony Tidbit: That is great.

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That is great.

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Dr.

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Burton, you know, as you stated

earlier, only parent, right.

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What was the, what inspired

you to, you know, go ahead.

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'cause you, as you said earlier,

I think it was six hours old

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when you had your daughter.

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Is that about the, correct.

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So tell us a little bit about your story.

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What inspired you to go ahead

and go, go into this route?

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Dr. Nsenga Burton: Yeah, so I.

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Um, have a grandfather who was adopted and

then on my dad's side, and then my mom's

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side, um, we have other, uh, folks who

are adopted on that side of the family.

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So I'd always been around.

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Um, my family was always

diverse in that way.

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Um, and so everybody was treated the same.

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There was no really differentiation.

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You just kind of learned, um, over

the years that, uh, those folks were

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adopted, but they were always our family.

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So I always thought in my head, I would.

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I would adopt.

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Um, I also thought I would get married

and have children, but I never got

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married and I never met anybody

I wanted to have children with.

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Laura Henderson: Um,

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Dr. Nsenga Burton: uh, which is not sad.

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Some people, when I say it,

they're like, Oh, it's okay.

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It's okay.

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Life is good.

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It's actually fantastic.

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Very stress free.

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In that way.

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And so, um, I decided.

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Once I got, I got to a certain age that,

um, and one of my girlfriends, I have

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to say this, um, actually a bunch of my

girlfriends have adopted, but one of my

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girlfriends I'm really tight with, she

was telling me, do you want to be a young

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mama or do you want to be an old mama?

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Which I think is funny.

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Cause I'm 51 now.

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So I'm an old mama, which cracks me up.

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So she kept telling me like through

the thirties, girl, you better do it.

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You know, to cut you off

girl, you better do it.

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Girl, you better do it.

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You know, they cut you off.

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Then ain't nobody wants you to raise,

you know, old, you know, old ass

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to raise, young kids, you better do

something, you better pull the trigger.

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So finally I was like, okay, I'm 43.

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I guess I better, I was enjoying

life, traveling all over the

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world, just having a great time.

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And I was like, okay.

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And not that, you know, having

kids, you can't enjoy life.

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It just makes your life different.

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You still enjoy it.

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: 00:15:27

So, um, Anyway, I decided

to pull the trigger.

317

: 00:15:31

I had to fall through.

318

: 00:15:32

Um, and then, and, and what's interesting,

people always tell you when you're

319

: 00:15:36

adopting, you know, whoever your baby

is, you'll know they'll, they'll, the

320

: 00:15:40

person you're supposed to be with,

or he's supposed to be with you.

321

: 00:15:42

They'll, they'll show up.

322

: 00:15:43

They'll, they'll be yours.

323

: 00:15:45

And that is very true.

324

: 00:15:46

Um, because my daughter and I, people.

325

: 00:15:49

They are like, you all look

alike, you sound alike, you feel

326

: 00:15:52

like, you know, all the things.

327

: 00:15:54

Um, but she really is the person

I was supposed to be with.

328

: 00:15:58

So, um, she was born.

329

: 00:16:00

Actually, I wasn't even I had, I'd

been here as a visiting professor in

330

: 00:16:03

Atlanta, and then I was going back

to Baltimore because I was living

331

: 00:16:06

in Baltimore between the two places.

332

: 00:16:09

And then long story short,

her mother found me.

333

: 00:16:12

Um, through just kind of like

adoption network, sort of,

334

: 00:16:15

and, um, the rest is history.

335

: 00:16:18

I, I drove through rain,

sleet, and snow to get her.

336

: 00:16:20

She was born down here.

337

: 00:16:22

Um, and, you know, we've been

together, I mean, for, since

338

: 00:16:27

she was literally six hours old.

339

: 00:16:29

That is awesome.

340

: 00:16:30

Tony Tidbit: So,

341

: 00:16:30

Dr. Nsenga Burton:

that's what prompted me.

342

: 00:16:31

I always wanted to be a mom.

343

: 00:16:32

I didn't know if I wanted to be a wife,

but I knew I wanted to be a mom, so.

344

: 00:16:35

Adoption was the best option for me.

345

: 00:16:37

And

346

: 00:16:37

Tony Tidbit: you know, I'm hearing

a theme because same thing you as,

347

: 00:16:40

as Aubree and Laura stated, um,

you had in your family, there was

348

: 00:16:45

familiarity in terms of adoption, right?

349

: 00:16:48

So, you know, and again, I, I don't know.

350

: 00:16:52

So it's just interesting to hear that all

three of you And from one way or another,

351

: 00:16:58

from a family standpoint, there was some

familiarity in terms of adoption, so

352

: 00:17:03

it didn't make it like daunting or it

probably was daunting, which we'll dive

353

: 00:17:07

into, but it wasn't like just I don't know

if I would want to do that or in case we

354

: 00:17:11

be because you've seen it in your family,

uh, either from a personal standpoint

355

: 00:17:16

or even from a legal standpoint.

356

: 00:17:18

Right?

357

: 00:17:18

So let me ask you this and

Laura, I'll go to you on this.

358

: 00:17:21

Okay.

359

: 00:17:21

What's a misconception, a

common misconception that

360

: 00:17:25

people think about adoption?

361

: 00:17:27

Laura Henderson: Uh, well, you

know, I think it's funny what Dr.

362

: 00:17:32

Burton was just saying about like,

the kids look like you, they act

363

: 00:17:37

like you, you know, it's not.

364

: 00:17:40

but it is my attitude

that's coming out of them.

365

: 00:17:43

Um, so they, um, they are little

mirrors and they are my kids, whether

366

: 00:17:50

they, you know, look like me or not,

you can tell who's raising them.

367

: 00:17:55

Um, and there's joy.

368

: 00:17:57

Like there's, there's not a difference,

whether we've had a kid in our home for

369

: 00:18:02

six years or six months, like, If you

let yourself fall in love with this kid,

370

: 00:18:07

you're gonna bond with them, whether

they're, you know, difficult to parent

371

: 00:18:13

for whatever reason, you know, that's

the thing they, they categorize in foster

372

: 00:18:17

care, is it, is it difficult to raise

kid because of different, um, factors

373

: 00:18:22

in their life and their story, and we've

had some of those, and we're just as

374

: 00:18:27

much as in love with them, you know, As

any other kid we we've had in our home.

375

: 00:18:31

So, uh, we've had a kid from four days

old and then we had a kid move in at nine

376

: 00:18:36

years old and we love them just as much.

377

: 00:18:40

So, um, that if you open up your

heart, it's going to happen.

378

: 00:18:45

You're going to fall in love with

them and then they'll scare you by

379

: 00:18:49

by, you know, mirroring you in ways

that you wish you didn't have to see.

380

: 00:18:53

You know,

381

: 00:18:54

Tony Tidbit: it's time

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382

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383

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384

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385

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386

: 00:19:18

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387

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388

: 00:19:22

E P.

389

: 00:19:24

Right, right.

390

: 00:19:25

I mean, that's a, that's an

excellent point though, right?

391

: 00:19:28

Because, you know, at the end of the day,

and if you think about even biological

392

: 00:19:33

parents, yes, there's, you know, going to

be some similarities in terms of looks,

393

: 00:19:37

but also from an attitude standpoint,

the way you bring your kids up, is

394

: 00:19:43

major, is a major influence in terms

of how they act or even how they think.

395

: 00:19:49

All right, and maybe even

think like you, right?

396

: 00:19:52

Because of the way that you've

been bringing them up and

397

: 00:19:54

teaching them certain things.

398

: 00:19:55

So those things are very important.

399

: 00:19:57

Let's dive into the process a little bit.

400

: 00:19:59

So Dr.

401

: 00:20:00

Burton, I'm going to go to you

on this, you know, single parent.

402

: 00:20:04

Your friend finally wore you down.

403

: 00:20:06

You better do this girl.

404

: 00:20:07

You better do it.

405

: 00:20:08

. Alright.

406

: 00:20:10

And you finally?

407

: 00:20:10

Yes.

408

: 00:20:11

Jayla, Jayla, Anderson Moore.

409

: 00:20:13

I'll do it.

410

: 00:20:13

I'll do it.

411

: 00:20:14

Alright.

412

: 00:20:17

, you know, being single.

413

: 00:20:19

Like, what were some of the most

significant challenges, um, and

414

: 00:20:24

during, you know, during the

process that, that you ran into?

415

: 00:20:29

And you know, also, what were some

of the assumptions that, you know,

416

: 00:20:34

people thought that since you're

going to be single, all right?

417

: 00:20:38

that you can't do this or this

is going to be too much for you.

418

: 00:20:42

Let's talk about that a little bit.

419

: 00:20:44

Dr. Nsenga Burton: Oh, Tony, you're

going back to where we were yesterday.

420

: 00:20:46

I see that good old racism, sexism,

heterosexism, all the stuff.

421

: 00:20:51

Um, Yeah, you know, uh, there is a

lot of discrimination against single

422

: 00:20:57

parents, um, in general in adoption.

423

: 00:21:00

Um, I would say black women, I mean,

it's, it's, you can Google it and

424

: 00:21:04

not like, you know, conspiracy theory

stuff, but like factual data exists,

425

: 00:21:09

um, about the discrimination that

LGBTQ, um, I, uh, plus populations,

426

: 00:21:15

uh, face, uh, in the adoption process.

427

: 00:21:17

So one of the challenges I

had was being a single person.

428

: 00:21:21

Many people who are making

decisions, and this is something

429

: 00:21:24

that people don't understand.

430

: 00:21:26

The adopt, the mother, the parent

of the biological parent is the

431

: 00:21:30

one who makes the choice, who says

yes to the actual adoptive parent.

432

: 00:21:35

Laura Henderson: So

433

: 00:21:36

Dr. Nsenga Burton: they,

it's really what they want.

434

: 00:21:38

Like you can say, Oh, I want a child.

435

: 00:21:39

I want to have blue eyes.

436

: 00:21:40

I want to have this.

437

: 00:21:41

You can have all of those

things in your head or whatever.

438

: 00:21:44

Ultimately the, the, the biological

parent is making the decision about

439

: 00:21:48

who and where their baby's going to go.

440

: 00:21:51

All right.

441

: 00:21:51

And so I didn't know that.

442

: 00:21:52

I think a lot of people don't know that

because you're just, you know, you're

443

: 00:21:55

thinking, okay, well, I'm adopting a baby.

444

: 00:21:56

So, of course, what I want

might, might, might go into a

445

: 00:21:59

Tony Tidbit: store, picking somebody out.

446

: 00:22:01

Right?

447

: 00:22:02

That's the thought

process that people think.

448

: 00:22:04

Right?

449

: 00:22:04

Dr. Nsenga Burton: Right.

450

: 00:22:04

Right.

451

: 00:22:05

It's not that, you know, it's a lot

like you do get to say some things

452

: 00:22:08

like, you know, some kind of medical

issues that, you know, are you, are

453

: 00:22:11

you, you know, Able to deal with some

of that can be quite expensive things of

454

: 00:22:14

that nature, but as a whole, like, you

really don't have too much saying it.

455

: 00:22:18

And honestly, I didn't

all I said was healthy.

456

: 00:22:20

I didn't care about gender.

457

: 00:22:22

Um, I didn't care about anything

other than, um, you know, a

458

: 00:22:25

couple of different categories.

459

: 00:22:27

Smart.

460

: 00:22:27

I said, please intelligent.

461

: 00:22:29

You know, I didn't know I

was gonna get a newborn.

462

: 00:22:30

I didn't know, but whatever.

463

: 00:22:32

Um, you know, those kind of

like my wish list, because, you

464

: 00:22:34

know, I'm a PhD, a professor and

stuff, some academics and stuff.

465

: 00:22:38

Um, but my point is,

they make the decision.

466

: 00:22:42

But what's interesting is when you

are a single parent, a lot of times

467

: 00:22:45

you lose out to 2 parent households.

468

: 00:22:48

Um, a lot of people who are making

these decisions usually come from

469

: 00:22:50

disenfranchised and vulnerable,

uh, situations and so they, uh,

470

: 00:22:55

assume, and this is an assumption,

um, that if you have 2 parents,

471

: 00:23:00

and if you have 2 incomes, then the

child's life is going to be better.

472

: 00:23:04

And that's a, you know, I won't

say it's an incorrect assumption,

473

: 00:23:07

but it is an assumption.

474

: 00:23:09

Right?

475

: 00:23:09

Um, So when you are a single parent,

especially as a black woman, um, with

476

: 00:23:15

all the stereotypes around being a black

woman and single black women, many of them

477

: 00:23:19

are negative and socially constructed.

478

: 00:23:21

They're not really

rooted in anything real.

479

: 00:23:23

Um, you know, you have

to deal with that too.

480

: 00:23:26

So it's like, do I want, um, this

single black, do I want my child

481

: 00:23:31

raised by a single black woman?

482

: 00:23:32

Even if I was financially able

to do it, it didn't matter.

483

: 00:23:35

It didn't matter.

484

: 00:23:36

All the things around.

485

: 00:23:37

So you have that, um, that kind

of, uh, uh, issue that you face.

486

: 00:23:42

And then, um, I think one of the adoption

agencies that ended up not going with,

487

: 00:23:47

um, was discriminatory in the sense that

I, she kept asking me, like, how are you

488

: 00:23:54

going to, cause this at the time I was

doing it, I was very high profile, um,

489

: 00:23:58

you know, I was, uh, editor at large for

a major, um, online, um, news publication.

490

: 00:24:04

And.

491

: 00:24:05

Um, I had a column in a, a major online,

you know, I was very high profile.

492

: 00:24:09

And so she kept asking me, uh,

well, how are you going to do this?

493

: 00:24:13

Like how, how you don't

have time to do this.

494

: 00:24:16

Uh, you, you know, just very

kind of, uh, projecting kind of

495

: 00:24:18

these old school ideas on to me.

496

: 00:24:21

Um, I wasn't married.

497

: 00:24:23

I have a high profile demanding job.

498

: 00:24:26

How on earth was I going to

be able to raise this child?

499

: 00:24:28

Something that they wouldn't,

you Well, maybe they do, but I

500

: 00:24:31

didn't see them asking, um, uh,

two parent households, like, you

501

: 00:24:35

know, both of you work full time.

502

: 00:24:37

So how are you going to make time to

take care of this child or what have you?

503

: 00:24:41

Um, so it's different things like that.

504

: 00:24:43

Um, it's not only race, it's also gender.

505

: 00:24:46

I would imagine I'm straight,

but I imagine it's sexuality.

506

: 00:24:50

Um, because people also assume if you're

single and you're adopted that you're gay.

507

: 00:24:54

Um, because I get a lot of that

as well, like people asking

508

: 00:24:56

me about my sexual identity.

509

: 00:24:58

Um, uh, as well as my gender identity.

510

: 00:25:01

Um, my hair was different then,

and people are stereotypically gay.

511

: 00:25:05

Motivated.

512

: 00:25:06

So they were asking me these

dumb dumb ass questions.

513

: 00:25:10

Excuse my language.

514

: 00:25:11

I cut a little bit.

515

: 00:25:12

Um, and so all of that was, I did

not expect or anticipate any of that

516

: 00:25:17

or not any of it, but I just was

surprised that people care so much

517

: 00:25:22

about socially constructed ideas that

really don't matter at the end of the

518

: 00:25:26

day in terms of having a healthy and

happy and well raised child, you know?

519

: 00:25:31

Yeah.

520

: 00:25:32

So those are some of the

things you deal with.

521

: 00:25:34

Tony Tidbit: Aubree, let me, let me,

let me, let me turn it towards you.

522

: 00:25:36

Same question.

523

: 00:25:38

All right.

524

: 00:25:38

Same sex couple.

525

: 00:25:40

What was some of the, you know, legal

barriers that you guys encountered?

526

: 00:25:44

Um, and, and as Dr.

527

: 00:25:46

Burton talked about the sexism,

racism, you know, all the

528

: 00:25:50

different things that she did.

529

: 00:25:51

I'd love to hear from you guys as well.

530

: 00:25:53

And, and, and Laura jump in when you can.

531

: 00:25:55

Aubree Henderson: Yeah.

532

: 00:25:56

I mean, so for us, it's a little

different since we went the foster care

533

: 00:25:59

route, you know, you become certified

as a foster parent with an agency.

534

: 00:26:03

Um, our agency is new alternatives

for children, which I'll shout them

535

: 00:26:07

out a bunch because we love them.

536

: 00:26:08

If you're in New York City, and

you're considering fostering, you

537

: 00:26:10

should check them out for sure.

538

: 00:26:12

Um, but, you know, for us, it's

and for most foster parents, to my

539

: 00:26:17

understanding, it's a process where

you go through a certification.

540

: 00:26:20

Ours.

541

: 00:26:21

Was pretty fast, but took, like, 6

months, you take classes, you do a lot

542

: 00:26:26

of the same home study type stuff that

that you do when you're doing adoption.

543

: 00:26:29

So you have somebody come in, like.

544

: 00:26:31

You know, look through your

home, make sure it's safe.

545

: 00:26:34

You have all these safety regulations

you have to, you know, put in place.

546

: 00:26:38

They you have to submit

your household budget.

547

: 00:26:42

Um, so they can know that you make

enough money to support a child, or that

548

: 00:26:46

you have a source of income somehow.

549

: 00:26:49

Um, there's just, there's a lot of

kind of those hoops that you have

550

: 00:26:52

to jump through to sort of like.

551

: 00:26:54

Prove yourself that you can be a

suitable parent that I know our friends

552

: 00:26:58

who have gone the adoption route have

described similar things, but for us,

553

: 00:27:04

you know, what's interesting is once

you are certified and licensed, then

554

: 00:27:08

it becomes actually in foster care.

555

: 00:27:10

More of a process of being able to

feel the requests for kids to come into

556

: 00:27:16

your home because you start getting

calls of, hey, this child needs a home.

557

: 00:27:20

And for us, it's the foster care agency.

558

: 00:27:23

Who's making the decisions about

which home could be a good fit.

559

: 00:27:26

So it's actually not the biological

parents have no say whatsoever in

560

: 00:27:31

at least in the case of our agency

is my understanding, which is, which

561

: 00:27:34

is, and it's a totally opposite side

of the spectrum that I actually,

562

: 00:27:38

in many ways, think is problematic.

563

: 00:27:39

Um, It's, you know, the child welfare

system is one that also disempowers,

564

: 00:27:45

you know, families who are involved

with it from the biological family side.

565

: 00:27:49

And so, so there's that piece.

566

: 00:27:51

Um, but so, you know, and our agency

also takes a big stance on, and I

567

: 00:27:56

believe the state of New York takes

a big stance on being supportive of

568

: 00:27:58

queer families and queer foster parents

and queer foster children and ensuring

569

: 00:28:03

that there's not discrimination that

happens and they have sort of systems

570

: 00:28:06

and structures in place around that.

571

: 00:28:08

So our experience from that lens.

572

: 00:28:10

Has been really good.

573

: 00:28:11

We actually, you know, have had meetings

with biological parents, um, where

574

: 00:28:16

there has been like an advocate from

the foster agency there on our behalf

575

: 00:28:20

to support us in that space in case

something homophobic was said, right?

576

: 00:28:25

Um, but also, I think, like, nothing

that I say can be taken away.

577

: 00:28:30

There's it's always

filtered through a lens of.

578

: 00:28:32

Our whiteness, right?

579

: 00:28:34

Laura and I show up looking very

much and behaving very much.

580

: 00:28:37

And also having the background of a lot

of the people who work at the foster care

581

: 00:28:41

agency, a lot, we have a ton in common

with our, all of our caseworkers, right.

582

: 00:28:46

Our people, we could have gone to grad

school with, and there's a, there's a

583

: 00:28:50

sort of way that we're privileged, I

think in some ways, and I, you know, I

584

: 00:28:54

think a lot of it is unconscious, but

that is something where I, I can't Dr.

585

: 00:29:01

Burton would have had that same experience

that we had being, being a foster parent

586

: 00:29:05

and feeling that level of supported.

587

: 00:29:07

Um, so that's just, yeah, um.

588

: 00:29:11

Yeah, but I, yeah, I think Laura,

do you have anything to add to that?

589

: 00:29:13

Laura Henderson: Well, I was just going

to say, I was going to underline what

590

: 00:29:15

she said about us living in New York

State, that takes some of these things

591

: 00:29:20

about discrimination very seriously.

592

: 00:29:23

And what's sad in our country is that,

you know, adoption, foster care, these are

593

: 00:29:29

systems that are used as political tools.

594

: 00:29:33

And in certain states with, you know,

conservative leadership, or where, you

595

: 00:29:36

know, You know, fundamentalist religious

organizations have strongholds like

596

: 00:29:41

the legal landscape and the approach is

very different and like, and it's really

597

: 00:29:46

important when you're thinking about.

598

: 00:29:49

You know, whether it's foster care

or adoption, researching the agency

599

: 00:29:52

that you're going to work with and

understanding who funds them and how

600

: 00:29:58

they're supported and what they believe

philosophically, because that will

601

: 00:30:01

change your experience, whether, you

know, you're a person of color, whether

602

: 00:30:06

you're a queer person, like, you see

it in the news about lawsuits over who

603

: 00:30:11

gets to be a parent and all of that.

604

: 00:30:13

And unfortunately,

that's just not the case.

605

: 00:30:15

Baked in to our political culture

and this experience of parenting.

606

: 00:30:21

Tony Tidbit: Let me just, and Dr.

607

: 00:30:22

Byrd, I want to come to you because

I'm going to ask you a similar

608

: 00:30:25

question, but I just want to

make sure I'm clear what I heard.

609

: 00:30:27

What you said, Aubree, is that

at the end of the day, you guys

610

: 00:30:31

are a same sex couple, right?

611

: 00:30:34

But what I'm, what I was hearing, And

again, it's foster care, so it's a

612

: 00:30:39

little bit different than adoption.

613

: 00:30:41

But what I was hearing is that because

you're two white people, at the end of

614

: 00:30:46

the day, the biases, the privilege of

being white doesn't really, uh, affect

615

: 00:30:54

the, the, or, or, or causes an issue in

terms of same sex or anything like that.

616

: 00:30:59

Is that what I'm hearing basically?

617

: 00:31:01

Aubree Henderson: I think it's

that for me, our, our whiteness has

618

: 00:31:05

played more of a distinctive role

in our experience than our queerness

619

: 00:31:09

has, I think is what I'm saying.

620

: 00:31:10

That's

621

: 00:31:11

Tony Tidbit: okay.

622

: 00:31:11

And so I heard it correctly.

623

: 00:31:12

Exactly.

624

: 00:31:13

That's what I thought.

625

: 00:31:13

Right.

626

: 00:31:14

So that's what, okay.

627

: 00:31:15

Interesting.

628

: 00:31:16

Dr.

629

: 00:31:16

Burton, same question.

630

: 00:31:17

Do you feel race And I think you

spoke a little bit about it earlier,

631

: 00:31:20

but you said gender and stuff.

632

: 00:31:22

Do you feel race in the process

affected you in any way throughout

633

: 00:31:28

this, throughout the process when

you're adopting your daughter?

634

: 00:31:31

Dr. Nsenga Burton: Oh yeah.

635

: 00:31:31

I mean, from the adoption fairs, when

you first get there, um, and they

636

: 00:31:36

have a list of kids and they have them

categorized by race and then they got

637

: 00:31:40

the black kids at the bottom and they

have the cheapest amount next to them.

638

: 00:31:45

When you say cheapest amount,

639

: 00:31:47

Tony Tidbit: what do you mean by that?

640

: 00:31:47

It looks like a

641

: 00:31:48

Dr. Nsenga Burton: slave trade, like those

old slave, um, documents that you see

642

: 00:31:51

where they have people and they have their

eyes and their teeth and their whatever,

643

: 00:31:54

and then they tell how much they cost.

644

: 00:31:56

In adoption fairs, some

of that still happens.

645

: 00:31:58

And so they'll have a list of kids,

it won't be the actual kids, but say

646

: 00:32:02

a white, you know, white newborn or

whatever, this is how much it'll cost you.

647

: 00:32:06

Uh, whatever, Latinx, biracial,

such and such, whatever.

648

: 00:32:10

The black kids are always at the

bottom, and they're always the cheapest.

649

: 00:32:15

Tony Tidbit: For real.

650

: 00:32:15

Dr. Nsenga Burton: So it starts there.

651

: 00:32:17

That was the first time where I

was just like, I can't do this.

652

: 00:32:20

I can't be a part of the system.

653

: 00:32:22

Yeah.

654

: 00:32:22

Tony Tidbit: Yeah.

655

: 00:32:22

Because then it seems like

so, so, so, so hold on.

656

: 00:32:27

Dr. Nsenga Burton: It's it's it's nervous.

657

: 00:32:30

Tony Tidbit: Yeah.

658

: 00:32:31

Yeah.

659

: 00:32:31

Let me just hold on.

660

: 00:32:32

Let's just put a pin here because I just

want to make sure I'm clear on this.

661

: 00:32:34

So what I'm hearing, you

finally, I want to love a child.

662

: 00:32:40

I want to bring love and put a

child in a beautiful family and

663

: 00:32:45

help nurture and bring them up.

664

: 00:32:47

And then when you start looking to go

through the process, you get a menu.

665

: 00:32:52

Okay.

666

: 00:32:53

And I'm, I'm kind of,

you know, simplifying it.

667

: 00:32:56

You get a menu.

668

: 00:32:58

of white, uh, and dollar signs.

669

: 00:33:01

Okay.

670

: 00:33:02

And then all the way down at the bottom

of the menu, or even if it's in the

671

: 00:33:06

middle, it doesn't really matter, but

the black is, and it's the cheapest.

672

: 00:33:11

Dr. Nsenga Burton: Yes.

673

: 00:33:12

Tony Tidbit: So this is how we,

this is the adoption system.

674

: 00:33:15

I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm a little

befuddled and shocked by that.

675

: 00:33:18

That's, I mean, so how do you,

how do you get so back to you?

676

: 00:33:23

I cut you off because

I'm a little shocked.

677

: 00:33:25

How do you even go back to the love part?

678

: 00:33:28

Because right off the bat, you,

you coming in loving, but then

679

: 00:33:33

you see that, wait a minute.

680

: 00:33:35

And then, so now even the person

that you do adopt this, a devalue

681

: 00:33:39

system on that individual based

on their race right off the bat.

682

: 00:33:44

Dr. Nsenga Burton: Right.

683

: 00:33:45

And then, um, I think that it's, you

know, being a member of a historically

684

: 00:33:51

disenfranchised group, 1 of the

things that people don't give us

685

: 00:33:55

credit for is our ability to navigate

systems that are set up against us.

686

: 00:34:00

And so, because we're able to.

687

: 00:34:04

Continue through the process because

we've been, we've been living life.

688

: 00:34:07

This is what we do.

689

: 00:34:08

We continue through the process despite,

or in spite of, because we have to get

690

: 00:34:12

these things that we need in order to

live the lives that we want to have.

691

: 00:34:16

Right.

692

: 00:34:16

And so the same thing is adoption

is not different from that.

693

: 00:34:19

Like when you see that just like, Oh

my God, how can I be a part of this?

694

: 00:34:21

Can we go again?

695

: 00:34:22

Tony Tidbit: Yeah, here we

696

: 00:34:23

Dr. Nsenga Burton: go.

697

: 00:34:24

You ask the questions, you

write the letters, you raise

698

: 00:34:27

the hell, but you keep moving.

699

: 00:34:29

Right.

700

: 00:34:30

Um, the woman who did my home study.

701

: 00:34:33

Uh, who was love, I loved her a lot

until I saw the final home study and

702

: 00:34:39

she wrote about me in a way I was

like, is this a plantation movie?

703

: 00:34:44

Like what are you like?

704

: 00:34:45

I literally made her re rewrite it.

705

: 00:34:47

I said, who is this?

706

: 00:34:49

What

707

: 00:34:50

Tony Tidbit: was how did she frame you

what was the narrative high level she

708

: 00:34:53

Dr. Nsenga Burton: described as a

mammy Like so she was like she's this

709

: 00:34:57

heavyset Um, uh, kind of like quiet.

710

: 00:35:04

I wish my dogs would be quiet right now.

711

: 00:35:05

Uh, quiet.

712

: 00:35:07

Um, uh, and I had another dog,

uh, me, rest in peace back then.

713

: 00:35:14

And I love me.

714

: 00:35:15

That was my first dog.

715

: 00:35:16

Like I had as an adult.

716

: 00:35:17

So I just treated her

like my little thing.

717

: 00:35:19

And, you know, the way she described me,

it was like the behavioral and physical

718

: 00:35:22

characteristics reflected that uh,

719

: 00:35:27

Tony Tidbit: Gone with the wind in a way.

720

: 00:35:29

Dr. Nsenga Burton: Are

they killing each other?

721

: 00:35:30

Yeah.

722

: 00:35:30

Yeah.

723

: 00:35:33

So, um, yeah, it reflected, it

reflected each other, uh, it reflected

724

: 00:35:38

that I think I was hyper aware of it,

obviously because I'm a media scholar

725

: 00:35:41

and I teach those things, right?

726

: 00:35:42

So I'm looking at it and I

was just like, who is this?

727

: 00:35:45

And she's like, well, what do you mean?

728

: 00:35:46

And it was on the first page.

729

: 00:35:48

I said, if you.

730

: 00:35:50

This way, no one is going to pick me

because I sound like I'm trapped in

731

: 00:35:56

a plantation from the last century.

732

: 00:35:59

So, I made her write it over and I gave

her suggested language and she, I told

733

: 00:36:06

you, she was a lovely lady in many ways.

734

: 00:36:08

I think that somehow sometimes how people.

735

: 00:36:11

Perceive us relatively, as opposed to who

we really are, they just don't see you.

736

: 00:36:16

So she saw the nice house, she saw

the professor, she saw the, she saw

737

: 00:36:20

the things, but she didn't see me.

738

: 00:36:22

Right.

739

: 00:36:23

And she came to my house like

three times or what have you.

740

: 00:36:26

Hold on, let me tell my

dogs to shut up real quick.

741

: 00:36:28

Tony Tidbit: Wow.

742

: 00:36:29

Wow.

743

: 00:36:29

So, so let me, I just want to, so

let me, what's, what's you ladies

744

: 00:36:35

thoughts on what you just heard Dr.

745

: 00:36:36

Burton?

746

: 00:36:37

And obviously it's different because

you guys are in the foster care system,

747

: 00:36:41

but what was your thoughts on that?

748

: 00:36:44

Aubree Henderson: I think it's

like, sadly that it doesn't, doesn't

749

: 00:36:47

surprise me or shock me necessarily.

750

: 00:36:49

Um, it's horrifying, of course.

751

: 00:36:52

I think it, it, it aligns a lot with,

you know, we have a, a close friend

752

: 00:36:56

who is a black woman and would, you

know, would be an only parent who, you

753

: 00:37:00

know, has had kind of like similarly

challenging, really crappy time with

754

: 00:37:07

kind of that process of becoming,

like going through the, the adoption.

755

: 00:37:12

Agency and jumping through all the

hoops and having the home studies and,

756

: 00:37:16

you know, the, that sort of experience.

757

: 00:37:18

And so, you know, it, it aligns with a

lot of what we've heard her share and

758

: 00:37:22

what I've read, um, you know, black

adoptive parents share specifically,

759

: 00:37:27

um, and is, you know, I also hear that.

760

: 00:37:32

And I just think that could not be more.

761

: 00:37:35

Different from the experience

that we had, and I think that

762

: 00:37:38

there's a lot of reasons for that.

763

: 00:37:40

But I think.

764

: 00:37:41

White privilege is a big component of it.

765

: 00:37:44

I think, like, you know, there are

there are many ways that, like, we

766

: 00:37:48

feel like, oh, we couldn't have been.

767

: 00:37:50

Facilitated through the

process any faster, right?

768

: 00:37:53

And some of that potentially is because

it's foster care and there's a need

769

: 00:37:56

for foster parents and all of that.

770

: 00:37:58

Right?

771

: 00:37:59

But I, I think it would be foolish to say

that there's no, there's no role that.

772

: 00:38:03

Our race plays in that.

773

: 00:38:06

Tony Tidbit: Did, did you

guys, Laura, this is for you.

774

: 00:38:08

Did you guys, did, was there any,

did you feel, uh, any discrimination

775

: 00:38:13

even in the foster care, um, platform

because you guys are same sex or you,

776

: 00:38:20

it was, was there anything in that,

that you felt like a regular couple

777

: 00:38:26

wouldn't have to deal with this regular

heterosexual couple wouldn't deal with?

778

: 00:38:30

Laura Henderson: Well, you know, um,

In our process of being licensed and

779

: 00:38:35

certified as foster parents, we have not,

we did not experience that, but a lot of

780

: 00:38:40

that is because of New York State and some

of the laws around anti discrimination

781

: 00:38:45

that we're benefiting from here.

782

: 00:38:48

Um, but, you know, in New York, the

discrimination that we have is more, um,

783

: 00:38:56

it's, it's more under the layers, right?

784

: 00:39:00

It is covered under the

rug a little bit with.

785

: 00:39:02

Neighborhood segregation and other things

that are happening here, um, and that most

786

: 00:39:07

kids in care are black here, or, you know,

and most, um, foster parents here are, in

787

: 00:39:15

our experience, I actually don't know the

data on this, but in our experience, a

788

: 00:39:18

lot of the other foster parents are like

grand, grandparents age, you know, it's

789

: 00:39:22

a lot of Caribbean grandmothers who raise

their kids, and they want to raise another

790

: 00:39:27

generation of kids so they get into it.

791

: 00:39:29

So, We benefit by being somewhat different

than your average foster parent here,

792

: 00:39:34

but that's sad to me because that, um,

way of understanding families and of

793

: 00:39:41

being an elder in your community and

continuing to care for kids is a model

794

: 00:39:46

that we would like to follow as parents.

795

: 00:39:48

I mean, that is not necessarily

that is from white culture, but

796

: 00:39:53

it's something that we're learning

from other cultures and see the

797

: 00:39:56

value of generational loving care.

798

: 00:39:59

Um, so, so We see that, you know, the

other folks get treated differently,

799

: 00:40:05

um, by the system itself or by, by the,

uh, you know, admins of the system.

800

: 00:40:11

But the other, the thing we have

actually experienced is that,

801

: 00:40:15

um, bio parents are very hesitant

about us at times as queer parents.

802

: 00:40:22

Bio parents in New York want to have,

you know, a mom and a dad for their

803

: 00:40:27

kid or the, you know, but once they

get to know us and they see that

804

: 00:40:30

we really love the kids and their

kids are treated well and safe.

805

: 00:40:33

We moved past that very quickly,

but we have had some funny, awkward

806

: 00:40:38

conversations about sexuality, um, with

our kids parents, and it's been very

807

: 00:40:44

respectful, and it's, and we've built

ties with them, but that has been a

808

: 00:40:47

thing that we've learned a lot from.

809

: 00:40:52

Tony Tidbit: Number one,

thank you for sharing that.

810

: 00:40:54

Let me ask you this.

811

: 00:40:55

I mean, I know it's different.

812

: 00:40:56

Then I'm going to go to you, Dr.

813

: 00:40:57

Burton.

814

: 00:40:58

So in terms, you have four kids, right?

815

: 00:41:00

Different ratio makeup.

816

: 00:41:02

How do you, and then look, I get

it that they're coming maybe out of

817

: 00:41:06

a situation that's not that great.

818

: 00:41:09

Um, how do you, how do you

talk about we're a family?

819

: 00:41:14

BEP Narrator: If you like what you hear

and want to join us on this journey

820

: 00:41:16

of making uncomfortable conversations

comfortable, I'd Please subscribe to

821

: 00:41:20

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822

: 00:41:25

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823

: 00:41:26

Hit subscribe now to stay connected

for more episodes that challenge,

824

: 00:41:29

inspire and lead the change.

825

: 00:41:32

Tony Tidbit: How do you, you know,

nobody looks each, nobody looks

826

: 00:41:36

like each one another, right?

827

: 00:41:38

You guys, same sex.

828

: 00:41:40

Talk about how you create that,

that, that love and, and because

829

: 00:41:44

they go to school, let's be fair.

830

: 00:41:46

Right?

831

: 00:41:47

And they're loving you guys

and they see you mom and this.

832

: 00:41:50

So talk a little bit about

the conversations that you

833

: 00:41:53

have with the kids, right?

834

: 00:41:55

To, to reinforce that this is a family.

835

: 00:41:59

This is no different than any other

family love and stuff to that nature.

836

: 00:42:02

I love to hear you guys feedback on that.

837

: 00:42:04

Aubree Henderson: Yeah.

838

: 00:42:05

I love this question.

839

: 00:42:06

I think, um, I mean, we spend a

lot of time and energy on this.

840

: 00:42:10

I think a big part of it for me And this

is how I think about foster parenting in

841

: 00:42:14

general, is that like, we very much view

ourselves as therapeutic parents, right?

842

: 00:42:18

It's above and beyond.

843

: 00:42:20

I think when, you know, when it's

a different experience than when

844

: 00:42:23

somebody gives birth to a child and

has that child for, you know, has that

845

: 00:42:28

connection from the beginning and not

to say that that type of parenthood

846

: 00:42:31

is not without its challenges.

847

: 00:42:33

It certainly is.

848

: 00:42:34

But I think there is a way that we try to

be intentional about being therapeutic.

849

: 00:42:39

And it's very much in

the same way that like.

850

: 00:42:41

If someone attended a support group,

you begin to feel a kinship with the

851

: 00:42:45

people in that support group, even

if you've all come from different

852

: 00:42:47

backgrounds, because you are coming

together to a supportive healing space.

853

: 00:42:51

And that's what I really

want our home to be like.

854

: 00:42:54

And that's what it ends up

feeling like, I think, for our

855

: 00:42:56

kids, from what they've shared.

856

: 00:42:58

A lot of that comes from creating

shared traditions together.

857

: 00:43:01

Right.

858

: 00:43:02

We have, you know, for a long time,

we did pizza Friday in our house where

859

: 00:43:06

every Friday we would order pizza and

something like that feels really simple,

860

: 00:43:11

I think, but it's something that the

kids connect to and they say, Oh, this

861

: 00:43:14

is our shared tradition as our family.

862

: 00:43:17

Right.

863

: 00:43:17

We have many things like that,

where it's about saying, okay,

864

: 00:43:21

we're operating as a unit, right.

865

: 00:43:23

It's also about how we frame

ourselves as their caregivers, right.

866

: 00:43:27

It's that, you know, they don't have

to call us, you know, if they don't

867

: 00:43:31

want to, th first names, that's fine.

868

: 00:43:35

transition to wanting to I think because

they hear us mom, but that's a big had

869

: 00:43:42

that with one of our him off at school

and he And, and this is a kid who

870

: 00:43:47

normally I drop him off at school and

he cannot like get me out the door fast

871

: 00:43:51

enough, like does not want to say bye.

872

: 00:43:53

And he pointed to me talking to

his friend and said, that's my mom.

873

: 00:43:57

And that's like a huge milestone in

foster care and an adoption, right?

874

: 00:44:02

Is that moment of like, oh, this

child believes this and will go

875

: 00:44:06

into a social environment where

kids are relentlessly picked on.

876

: 00:44:09

I mean, like, correct kids, kids are,

you know, Mean to each other at times.

877

: 00:44:14

And so our kids, they

get picked on, right?

878

: 00:44:17

Our oldest son, he's 13.

879

: 00:44:19

He's a young black man.

880

: 00:44:21

He, his kids or his, his classmates, kids

in his class see us and are like, you

881

: 00:44:26

have two moms and they're white moms.

882

: 00:44:27

Like, are you kidding me?

883

: 00:44:29

Right.

884

: 00:44:29

And he, he feels a lot of

embarrassment around that, but I think.

885

: 00:44:33

For us, we don't shy away from that.

886

: 00:44:36

We want to talk to him about that.

887

: 00:44:37

We want to draw that out.

888

: 00:44:38

We want to say, what can

we do to support you?

889

: 00:44:40

We get the, we get what it

feels like to feel different.

890

: 00:44:43

We understand that in our own ways.

891

: 00:44:45

We want to support you.

892

: 00:44:47

And so it's it's a big part

of it is also about not shying

893

: 00:44:50

away from what's hard, right?

894

: 00:44:52

Not pretending that the difficult stuff

isn't there Not pretending that they

895

: 00:44:56

didn't all have a traumatic event that

caused them to be removed from their

896

: 00:45:00

biological family And maybe cycle

through multiple foster homes, right?

897

: 00:45:04

But acknowledging that and saying

like it's okay to feel all the

898

: 00:45:07

things that you feel about that.

899

: 00:45:08

You're safe here.

900

: 00:45:12

Tony Tidbit: That is awesome And

laura, I don't see if you want

901

: 00:45:15

to add anything too, but Aubree.

902

: 00:45:16

I got a follow up question Real

quickly So today, was it today

903

: 00:45:22

when you dropped him off at school?

904

: 00:45:23

And he said, you're my, this is my mother.

905

: 00:45:27

Okay.

906

: 00:45:27

How did that make you feel?

907

: 00:45:29

Aubree Henderson: There's

no better feeling.

908

: 00:45:30

I walked out of the school and I texted

Laura immediately like, Oh my God,

909

: 00:45:33

you're never going to believe this.

910

: 00:45:34

Right.

911

: 00:45:35

Because you, you also just see

the trajectory for kids, right?

912

: 00:45:39

They, they go from, you know, often kids

who are especially kids who have come from

913

: 00:45:43

foster care, but also kids from adoption.

914

: 00:45:45

Right.

915

: 00:45:46

There's trauma that is just inherent

in that that you're not in it.

916

: 00:45:49

That's true.

917

: 00:45:50

Whether you adopt a child as the

moment they're born, or 10 years in

918

: 00:45:55

right there, being separated from your

biological family is a traumatic event.

919

: 00:46:01

And so for our kids, there's just

there's a process where they're gonna.

920

: 00:46:04

Protect themselves by being quickly

by pushing you away by saying some of

921

: 00:46:11

just, I mean, we've heard some of the

meanest stuff from our kids, but we

922

: 00:46:14

know at the end of the day that they're

testing to see if we'll stick around.

923

: 00:46:19

Right.

924

: 00:46:19

That's what it is.

925

: 00:46:20

And so

926

: 00:46:21

Tony Tidbit: true.

927

: 00:46:22

It is.

928

: 00:46:22

So there's

929

: 00:46:22

Aubree Henderson: that feeling of like,

Oh my God, he, he believes that I'm

930

: 00:46:26

going to keep dropping him off at school

and every day saying, Hey, I love you.

931

: 00:46:29

Have a good day.

932

: 00:46:30

Even if he doesn't say it back, it's

not conditional on him saying it back.

933

: 00:46:33

Right.

934

: 00:46:34

And so there's something really deeply

rewarding and like nourishing and

935

: 00:46:39

healing for me as a parent to really

feel that like, Oh, he believed it.

936

: 00:46:42

That

937

: 00:46:44

Tony Tidbit: is awesome.

938

: 00:46:45

Laura, I would

939

: 00:46:46

Laura Henderson: just say, you know,

like, It's not a zero sum game.

940

: 00:46:49

It's not us versus the

biological parents, right?

941

: 00:46:52

So our kids will always miss and

long for their moms, their bio moms.

942

: 00:47:01

And as some of them we have a relationship

with and we see them all the time

943

: 00:47:05

or we have, You know, structured

court mandated visits with, right?

944

: 00:47:10

So some of them see their

families all the time.

945

: 00:47:13

And, and our kids who don't

grieve that all the time,

946

: 00:47:18

and it comes up all the time.

947

: 00:47:20

And it's, it's not, that doesn't hurt me.

948

: 00:47:23

That doesn't mean they love me less.

949

: 00:47:25

That means they wish desperately that we

all could be together in one happy family.

950

: 00:47:31

You know, like one of our

kids used to ask, like, Can

951

: 00:47:34

my mom just move in with us?

952

: 00:47:36

Like, why can't she live here, too?

953

: 00:47:39

And I think some of that is is

a recognition in like child My

954

: 00:47:44

mom needs safety and love, too.

955

: 00:47:47

So what I'm getting, she needs.

956

: 00:47:49

Um, and so, this is about, you

know, like, foster care and adoption

957

: 00:47:53

is about expanding families,

not, you know, it should not be

958

: 00:47:57

about separating or keeping away.

959

: 00:47:59

from certain members of the family.

960

: 00:48:04

Tony Tidbit: You guys gonna make

me cry on this show here, right?

961

: 00:48:06

I'm trying not to, okay?

962

: 00:48:08

But this is beautiful.

963

: 00:48:09

Dr.

964

: 00:48:10

Burton, talk a little bit about,

you know, the conversation or the

965

: 00:48:14

communication that you have with your

daughter in terms of family and, you

966

: 00:48:19

know, did you tell her she was adopted?

967

: 00:48:21

I would love to hear that.

968

: 00:48:22

Dr. Nsenga Burton: Oh yeah, yeah.

969

: 00:48:23

I told her, um, my Kai is very bright.

970

: 00:48:26

And, um, I told her from the very

beginning that, um, cause you know,

971

: 00:48:31

they come home and they talk about, Oh,

mommy, when I was in your belly, right?

972

: 00:48:35

Yeah, exactly.

973

: 00:48:35

Tony Tidbit: Exactly.

974

: 00:48:36

Dr. Nsenga Burton: Right.

975

: 00:48:37

And so I said, no, no, some of

the, you know, some babies grow

976

: 00:48:39

in their mommy's bellies, other

babies grow in their mommy's hearts.

977

: 00:48:42

Right?

978

: 00:48:42

And so that's how we

started the conversation.

979

: 00:48:44

And, um, I've always told

her that she was adopted.

980

: 00:48:48

Um, yeah.

981

: 00:48:48

Her biological mom would have closed

adoption, but I pushed for an open

982

: 00:48:53

adoption because I just feel like

kids need to know where they come

983

: 00:48:56

from, where they got their face from.

984

: 00:48:58

You also want to know medical history

because in the adoption process, they

985

: 00:49:02

do ask, but they only go back to, like,

they'll ask about the parents and the

986

: 00:49:06

grandparents, but they'll ask about aunts

and uncles and all that kind of stuff.

987

: 00:49:09

And, um.

988

: 00:49:10

So, I just thought it was just a

better idea to at least be able to

989

: 00:49:15

contact her, which was great because

we've actually, because I push for it.

990

: 00:49:19

We're actually great friends now.

991

: 00:49:21

And, um, uh, we share time and space

together and all the things and we

992

: 00:49:27

have phone calls and FaceTime calls

and all the things like that too.

993

: 00:49:32

And so when I talk to my daughter, you

know, you want to do it when it's age

994

: 00:49:36

appropriate, like you have to use age

appropriate language and what have you.

995

: 00:49:40

Um, but she knows I'm mom.

996

: 00:49:42

And, um, I love her unconditionally.

997

: 00:49:45

She loves me unconditionally.

998

: 00:49:46

It's just us.

999

: 00:49:46

So we're super tight.

: 1000

00:49:48,450 --> 00:49:53,010

Um, it's funny, uh, because we

have such a strong bond, you know,

: 1001

00:49:53,010 --> 00:49:54,440

that even other people can see.

: 1002

00:49:54,960 --> 00:49:59,509

And, um, so I think I'm very blessed

in that way because I know even

: 1003

00:49:59,510 --> 00:50:02,560

people who have biological children

sometimes don't bond with them ever.

: 1004

00:50:02,909 --> 00:50:05,269

And sometimes not for years

at a time or what happened.

: 1005

00:50:05,669 --> 00:50:06,629

She just always had it.

: 1006

00:50:06,629 --> 00:50:10,199

She just came to me and she's

been with me, um, ever since.

: 1007

00:50:10,279 --> 00:50:10,779

So.

: 1008

00:50:11,070 --> 00:50:12,740

You know, we talk very transparently.

: 1009

00:50:12,760 --> 00:50:15,520

Her brother, she's a biological

brother who was born after her.

: 1010

00:50:15,850 --> 00:50:17,100

My friends adopted him.

: 1011

00:50:17,460 --> 00:50:22,120

So when you talk about expanding families,

Laura, you are not like it is true.

: 1012

00:50:22,120 --> 00:50:26,220

So now we have this, well, we call

it the Kumbaya effect where we're all

: 1013

00:50:26,240 --> 00:50:27,920

together, they 10 minutes from me.

: 1014

00:50:28,190 --> 00:50:30,660

We do, um, some holidays together.

: 1015

00:50:30,670 --> 00:50:31,759

We have play dates.

: 1016

00:50:31,780 --> 00:50:35,890

We're in the same Jack and Jill group,

um, chapter, all the things we, we

: 1017

00:50:35,890 --> 00:50:39,700

just kind of do together to make sure

that we keep them together, even though

: 1018

00:50:39,700 --> 00:50:41,180

they live in separate households.

: 1019

00:50:41,220 --> 00:50:41,550

Right.

: 1020

00:50:41,900 --> 00:50:48,480

So, um, it's just, about honesty,

transparency, and making sure that the

: 1021

00:50:48,480 --> 00:50:51,200

language that you use is age appropriate.

: 1022

00:50:51,480 --> 00:50:55,400

And, you know, never, um, I never

want her, you know, her mother,

: 1023

00:50:55,550 --> 00:50:58,760

biological mother gave me the

greatest gift I've ever had.

: 1024

00:50:59,310 --> 00:51:03,649

So I never want her to think poorly

of her because I also understand that

: 1025

00:51:03,759 --> 00:51:07,470

she'll also think poorly of herself

because that's how our psychology works.

: 1026

00:51:08,080 --> 00:51:11,590

Um, and so I always

try to uplift, inspire.

: 1027

00:51:11,925 --> 00:51:16,355

And make sure that we have positive

interactions, um, at all times.

: 1028

00:51:17,325 --> 00:51:21,115

Tony Tidbit: That is, I mean, again, I

mean, you guys gonna push me over the

: 1029

00:51:21,125 --> 00:51:23,465

top and tons of tears in a minute, right?

: 1030

00:51:23,785 --> 00:51:27,815

I was trying to hold back and then

Dr Burton, Oh my God, you know what

: 1031

00:51:27,815 --> 00:51:33,914

I'm learning and I'm going to your

specific journey, Dr Burton, you

: 1032

00:51:33,915 --> 00:51:39,445

know, when you said that, um, she

wanted to close adoption and you

: 1033

00:51:39,465 --> 00:51:41,565

push for an open adoption, right?

: 1034

00:51:42,025 --> 00:51:46,280

And The good news is, is luckily you

did because at the end of the day,

: 1035

00:51:46,520 --> 00:51:51,300

we're all human beings and what we

think we want or we would never do

: 1036

00:51:51,310 --> 00:51:54,730

one day, we end up changing, right?

: 1037

00:51:54,969 --> 00:51:59,189

And, you know, I've heard

stories of people who had closed

: 1038

00:51:59,190 --> 00:52:04,120

adoptions, but then later on, they

want to find their biological.

: 1039

00:52:04,290 --> 00:52:05,290

Kids, right?

: 1040

00:52:05,540 --> 00:52:08,470

And then the parent, uh, agreed to that.

: 1041

00:52:08,760 --> 00:52:12,619

The adopted parent and now is an

issue because now they might not

: 1042

00:52:12,620 --> 00:52:15,960

have told them that they were adopted

because it was a closed thing.

: 1043

00:52:16,290 --> 00:52:19,409

And now this opens up a

whole can of worms, right?

: 1044

00:52:19,689 --> 00:52:22,639

And so I love the way you,

you, you really push for that.

: 1045

00:52:22,639 --> 00:52:26,890

But more importantly, I love from all

of you guys about the transparency The

: 1046

00:52:26,890 --> 00:52:31,760

communication, you know, being intentional

as you were saying, you know, Lauren

: 1047

00:52:31,760 --> 00:52:36,939

Aubree about dealing with these issues

that come up and not running from them.

: 1048

00:52:37,280 --> 00:52:40,630

Because a lot of times when we try

to hide, and I don't want to use

: 1049

00:52:40,630 --> 00:52:45,049

the word hide, but when we try to,

you know, deflect or don't bring up

: 1050

00:52:45,050 --> 00:52:48,780

certain things or don't deal with

them, uh, any type of confrontation

: 1051

00:52:48,780 --> 00:52:51,050

right off the bat, it only gets bigger.

: 1052

00:52:51,075 --> 00:52:51,545

Right.

: 1053

00:52:51,765 --> 00:52:55,515

And it turns into something that could

have been handled from the get go.

: 1054

00:52:55,515 --> 00:52:58,055

So the question I have for you

guys is we get ready to close.

: 1055

00:52:58,485 --> 00:53:01,955

I want to hear from each of you

because they're I think Dr Burton,

: 1056

00:53:01,975 --> 00:53:06,194

you said yesterday, 400, 000 kids

that are waiting to be adopted.

: 1057

00:53:06,194 --> 00:53:09,074

And I think is that correct

or something of that nature?

: 1058

00:53:09,474 --> 00:53:12,940

I believe only 10 percent of

kids end up Half a million.

: 1059

00:53:13,120 --> 00:53:16,210

Only 10 percent of kids end

up getting adopted when you

: 1060

00:53:16,210 --> 00:53:17,900

break down the ratio barriers.

: 1061

00:53:18,270 --> 00:53:24,310

It becomes even smaller than that based

on outside of for people of color.

: 1062

00:53:24,610 --> 00:53:29,240

Um, you know, the foster

home, um, mechanism is insane.

: 1063

00:53:29,579 --> 00:53:32,820

Um, there's a ton of kids that are

in foster home because parents.

: 1064

00:53:33,345 --> 00:53:36,455

For whatever reason, and back

to your initial point, Dr.

: 1065

00:53:36,455 --> 00:53:40,125

Burton, when you were like, look, I,

I didn't, I didn't want a husband,

: 1066

00:53:40,345 --> 00:53:42,175

but I knew I wanted a baby, right?

: 1067

00:53:42,175 --> 00:53:45,665

And there's people who have babies

and then end up don't wanting them.

: 1068

00:53:46,005 --> 00:53:46,585

Okay.

: 1069

00:53:46,585 --> 00:53:48,744

Or they can barely take

care of themselves.

: 1070

00:53:48,744 --> 00:53:51,845

And then they, they end up having children

and they can't take care of the children.

: 1071

00:53:51,845 --> 00:53:52,245

Right.

: 1072

00:53:52,895 --> 00:53:57,165

And so I would love for you guys

to tell the audience why from an

: 1073

00:53:57,165 --> 00:54:03,355

adoption standpoint, from a, uh,

a foster home standpoint, why.

: 1074

00:54:03,595 --> 00:54:08,785

What advice would you give them and why

this could be a, a, a, a great alternative

: 1075

00:54:09,075 --> 00:54:14,884

for them, regardless if they have

biological kids or regardless if they want

: 1076

00:54:14,884 --> 00:54:16,805

to, you know, they, they don't have kids.

: 1077

00:54:16,875 --> 00:54:18,634

Uh, I'll, I'll start

with you first, Laura.

: 1078

00:54:18,884 --> 00:54:22,544

Laura Henderson: I mean, the easy

answer is there's no greater joy.

: 1079

00:54:22,604 --> 00:54:27,525

I mean, it's, I'm corny when it comes

to this about why you should foster or

: 1080

00:54:27,525 --> 00:54:34,620

adopt it to love, fall in love with a

human being who's not Your kin who's

: 1081

00:54:34,620 --> 00:54:40,430

not your blood and make them your

blood and kin is, um, a heart expanding

: 1082

00:54:40,450 --> 00:54:43,610

project, and it has so much joy.

: 1083

00:54:43,890 --> 00:54:49,429

And, uh, we often get asked, you

know, I have other kids, is it going

: 1084

00:54:49,429 --> 00:54:52,060

to be okay if we foster or adopt?

: 1085

00:54:52,070 --> 00:54:53,560

And our answer is yes!

: 1086

00:54:53,850 --> 00:55:00,380

And show them, model for them that

experience too, that our family can add.

: 1087

00:55:00,685 --> 00:55:04,015

To us in this way and can grow in love.

: 1088

00:55:04,025 --> 00:55:06,875

So it's just it's the best experience.

: 1089

00:55:06,875 --> 00:55:09,295

That's the easy short answer

: 1090

00:55:09,765 --> 00:55:10,335

Tony Tidbit: Awesome.

: 1091

00:55:10,425 --> 00:55:11,025

Awesome.

: 1092

00:55:11,225 --> 00:55:11,475

Dr.

: 1093

00:55:11,475 --> 00:55:11,945

Burton.

: 1094

00:55:12,925 --> 00:55:14,005

Dr. Nsenga Burton: Um, yeah

: 1095

00:55:17,145 --> 00:55:21,595

I think I want to say 2 things I didn't

say before for people who are thinking

: 1096

00:55:21,605 --> 00:55:26,705

about adopting 1 of which is that

there is a cut off sometimes at age 50.

: 1097

00:55:26,814 --> 00:55:30,765

so you really said I was joking about

her pushing me along or whatever.

: 1098

00:55:30,765 --> 00:55:34,495

But for adoption agencies, the 50 is the

cut off in the United States, typically

: 1099

00:55:34,755 --> 00:55:36,155

when they won't let you adopt anymore.

: 1100

00:55:36,495 --> 00:55:39,735

And you also have to go through health

screenings to make sure that you're going

: 1101

00:55:39,735 --> 00:55:41,155

to be around to actually take care of the.

: 1102

00:55:41,330 --> 00:55:43,990

The child, and then you have

to have a will and a succession

: 1103

00:55:43,990 --> 00:55:45,360

plan if anything happens to you.

: 1104

00:55:45,680 --> 00:55:48,900

So do those, those 3 things have to

be in place in order for you to adopt.

: 1105

00:55:49,329 --> 00:55:53,989

But what I will say for, um, black

people, we've been doing this our whole

: 1106

00:55:53,989 --> 00:55:55,670

lives, especially in this country.

: 1107

00:55:55,670 --> 00:55:57,830

Actually, before we got

here, but certainly in this

: 1108

00:55:57,830 --> 00:55:59,769

country, taking in children.

: 1109

00:56:00,835 --> 00:56:04,285

We were separated from whether we

talk about slavery, whether we talk

: 1110

00:56:04,295 --> 00:56:07,905

about, you know, Jim Crow laws and

people being incarcerated unjustly.

: 1111

00:56:07,905 --> 00:56:10,504

And you know, you got a whole

family that has to be taken care of.

: 1112

00:56:10,504 --> 00:56:14,315

Whether you talk about people losing a

home to a fire at a time of black people

: 1113

00:56:14,374 --> 00:56:17,545

couldn't get insurance, which people don't

talk about those things we couldn't get.

: 1114

00:56:17,954 --> 00:56:19,784

Um, and so there's no

way to replace the home.

: 1115

00:56:19,784 --> 00:56:22,444

So you can afford to buy another

one or build another one and

: 1116

00:56:22,444 --> 00:56:24,074

taking in whole families for that.

: 1117

00:56:24,084 --> 00:56:27,034

So we've been doing this

work our entire lives.

: 1118

00:56:27,384 --> 00:56:28,744

So we are actually.

: 1119

00:56:29,675 --> 00:56:36,225

ready to be foster parents ready to

be adopted parents because we take

: 1120

00:56:36,295 --> 00:56:39,255

people in kids in all the time.

: 1121

00:56:39,265 --> 00:56:40,505

That is part of our culture.

: 1122

00:56:40,885 --> 00:56:42,004

Um, and it doesn't matter.

: 1123

00:56:42,004 --> 00:56:45,955

Just like Laura, I think I think it

was Laura who said it Caribbean folk.

: 1124

00:56:46,150 --> 00:56:49,410

African folk, anywhere from the

continent of Africa, any country,

: 1125

00:56:49,410 --> 00:56:54,470

pick one, the United States, the

UK, we do this all over the world.

: 1126

00:56:54,510 --> 00:56:56,560

It is part of who we are as a people.

: 1127

00:56:56,910 --> 00:57:02,480

So don't think of it as something

different and don't, um, map, um,

: 1128

00:57:02,490 --> 00:57:06,675

white patriarchal, uh, Biblical

constructions onto your life.

: 1129

00:57:07,395 --> 00:57:08,765

This is who we are.

: 1130

00:57:08,795 --> 00:57:10,265

This is what we do.

: 1131

00:57:10,555 --> 00:57:16,115

And we should not let that be defined

by these, um, other, um, and I hate

: 1132

00:57:16,115 --> 00:57:20,884

the other people, but by these, uh,

systems of power that make us go

: 1133

00:57:20,885 --> 00:57:22,505

against who we are and what we do.

: 1134

00:57:23,035 --> 00:57:24,865

Um, and so I say this to you.

: 1135

00:57:25,215 --> 00:57:26,365

We do this anyway.

: 1136

00:57:26,575 --> 00:57:27,185

Why not?

: 1137

00:57:27,215 --> 00:57:31,965

If you can afford it again, if you

are mentally and physically healthy,

: 1138

00:57:32,335 --> 00:57:37,484

um, if you are full of love and

kindness and patience and compassion

: 1139

00:57:37,505 --> 00:57:44,395

and empathy, adopt a child, foster a

child, um, and help, help children out.

: 1140

00:57:44,425 --> 00:57:49,715

Um, I have a friend now her, her,

uh, son's girlfriend is, um, in a, an

: 1141

00:57:49,725 --> 00:57:51,925

orphanage, you know, uh, in an orphanage.

: 1142

00:57:51,955 --> 00:57:53,845

And so she's helping her.

: 1143

00:57:55,250 --> 00:57:56,030

Go to college.

: 1144

00:57:56,040 --> 00:57:59,110

She's helping her have a place

to stay when she ages out.

: 1145

00:57:59,110 --> 00:58:00,480

A lot of kids age out of the system.

: 1146

00:58:00,490 --> 00:58:04,230

You can help them then if you can't help

them now, give them a place to stay.

: 1147

00:58:04,270 --> 00:58:05,000

I know in the A.

: 1148

00:58:05,010 --> 00:58:05,200

U.

: 1149

00:58:05,200 --> 00:58:05,459

C.

: 1150

00:58:05,459 --> 00:58:10,849

they have, um, a program where kids who

have aged out of the system and they don't

: 1151

00:58:10,849 --> 00:58:15,050

have places to go during the holidays

where they can come and be together and,

: 1152

00:58:15,170 --> 00:58:17,450

uh, be with families during the holiday.

: 1153

00:58:17,450 --> 00:58:19,580

So there are different ways that

you can help in different ways

: 1154

00:58:19,580 --> 00:58:20,739

that you can be a part of these.

: 1155

00:58:21,895 --> 00:58:26,325

These, uh, systems or, um, to meet these

needs where you don't have to necessarily

: 1156

00:58:26,325 --> 00:58:30,325

become a foster parent per se, or an

adoptive parent, um, but there are ways

: 1157

00:58:30,325 --> 00:58:34,755

that you can support children, um, through

the different stages of their lives.

: 1158

00:58:35,075 --> 00:58:38,124

So just kind of think creatively

about it as well, particularly

: 1159

00:58:38,124 --> 00:58:40,945

because we're already doing this work.

: 1160

00:58:41,555 --> 00:58:42,495

Tony Tidbit: Right, right.

: 1161

00:58:42,765 --> 00:58:44,565

Aubree, you get the last word.

: 1162

00:58:44,985 --> 00:58:47,645

Aubree Henderson: Yeah, I think I

love so much of what's been said.

: 1163

00:58:47,865 --> 00:58:49,375

I think I would just add.

: 1164

00:58:50,090 --> 00:58:54,850

You know, from a queer perspective, like

Laura was saying earlier, there is just

: 1165

00:58:54,850 --> 00:59:00,719

something so special and so meaningful

about this expansive idea of family and of

: 1166

00:59:00,719 --> 00:59:06,825

chosen family that I think is part of what

makes You know, we all sort of have had a

: 1167

00:59:06,875 --> 00:59:11,215

different exposure to it where, you know,

adoption, foster care are like part of

: 1168

00:59:11,215 --> 00:59:14,064

our normal maps for how family is created.

: 1169

00:59:14,065 --> 00:59:14,675

But I think.

: 1170

00:59:15,115 --> 00:59:18,065

If even if you're entering into it from

a place where you haven't been exposed

: 1171

00:59:18,065 --> 00:59:22,874

to that, you haven't experienced that

just inviting people into a space

: 1172

00:59:22,874 --> 00:59:26,245

where you think more expansively

about what family means to you, right?

: 1173

00:59:26,245 --> 00:59:29,085

What it means to have a

family and to create a family.

: 1174

00:59:29,125 --> 00:59:32,255

And I think, you know,

I, I grew up very much.

: 1175

00:59:32,264 --> 00:59:32,645

I grew up.

: 1176

00:59:32,930 --> 00:59:39,520

Um, Dr Burton also as the child of an

only parent and who was, you know, as I

: 1177

00:59:39,520 --> 00:59:41,840

described, was always kind of taking in.

: 1178

00:59:42,485 --> 00:59:45,845

People who needed to be taken in,

whether that was literally come

: 1179

00:59:45,845 --> 00:59:48,835

live with us, whether that was

just come be safe in our home.

: 1180

00:59:49,485 --> 00:59:55,335

And I like the idea that like that I'm

continuing that in my family and in

: 1181

00:59:55,345 --> 00:59:56,885

the way I'm creating my family now.

: 1182

00:59:56,885 --> 01:00:01,135

And I know that my kids are going

to grow up to have a similar outlook

: 1183

01:00:01,135 --> 01:00:05,275

and view because of what they have

experienced being a part of our family.

: 1184

01:00:05,295 --> 01:00:09,415

And so I think to me, it's, yeah,

it is rejecting that sort of like

: 1185

01:00:09,445 --> 01:00:14,800

white hetero patriarchal conception

of like the nuclear family that, you

: 1186

01:00:14,800 --> 01:00:16,380

know, can only look a certain way.

: 1187

01:00:16,380 --> 01:00:21,140

And I think as queer people too, like

we know a lot of us get ejected from

: 1188

01:00:21,140 --> 01:00:23,950

our families because of who we are.

: 1189

01:00:23,970 --> 01:00:28,430

And, you know, that's not what's happened

for any of our children, but you know, you

: 1190

01:00:28,430 --> 01:00:32,260

know what that, you know what that pain is

as a queer person to be rejected in that

: 1191

01:00:32,260 --> 01:00:37,150

way, or to be separate from your family

and to, you know, be able to provide

: 1192

01:00:37,150 --> 01:00:39,050

care and to provide love and safety.

: 1193

01:00:39,795 --> 01:00:42,464

For kids is really,

there's nothing like it.

: 1194

01:00:43,745 --> 01:00:44,775

Tony Tidbit: That is awesome.

: 1195

01:00:45,005 --> 01:00:47,905

So listen, I said, I had,

I got one final question.

: 1196

01:00:48,595 --> 01:00:50,135

I'm going to ask you guys a question.

: 1197

01:00:50,235 --> 01:00:51,545

I want one word.

: 1198

01:00:51,795 --> 01:00:53,165

I don't want nothing else.

: 1199

01:00:53,575 --> 01:00:56,305

I want you to answer it with one word.

: 1200

01:00:56,665 --> 01:00:57,315

Okay.

: 1201

01:00:58,325 --> 01:01:06,095

Based on your experience, your

journey, the ups, downs, good, bad.

: 1202

01:01:06,845 --> 01:01:08,295

From adopting Dr.

: 1203

01:01:08,295 --> 01:01:14,885

Burton to foster parenting, um, from

the Hendersons, what is the one word?

: 1204

01:01:15,715 --> 01:01:19,145

throughout that journey

that you will say about it.

: 1205

01:01:19,655 --> 01:01:20,935

I'll start with Laura first.

: 1206

01:01:20,935 --> 01:01:21,405

One word.

: 1207

01:01:24,405 --> 01:01:24,985

All right.

: 1208

01:01:25,575 --> 01:01:26,285

Aubree.

: 1209

01:01:27,295 --> 01:01:27,795

Dr. Nsenga Burton: Healing.

: 1210

01:01:29,575 --> 01:01:30,165

Tony Tidbit: All right.

: 1211

01:01:30,235 --> 01:01:30,515

Dr.

: 1212

01:01:30,515 --> 01:01:30,885

Burton

: 1213

01:01:31,405 --> 01:01:32,225

Dr. Nsenga Burton: resiliency.

: 1214

01:01:33,905 --> 01:01:34,495

Tony Tidbit: I love it.

: 1215

01:01:34,505 --> 01:01:34,895

Hope.

: 1216

01:01:35,235 --> 01:01:36,905

Oh, I love it.

: 1217

01:01:37,055 --> 01:01:38,365

You guys just killed it.

: 1218

01:01:38,765 --> 01:01:39,685

You killed it.

: 1219

01:01:39,745 --> 01:01:40,425

I loved it.

: 1220

01:01:40,425 --> 01:01:44,905

And you encapsulated in those

one words, this whole episode

: 1221

01:01:45,465 --> 01:01:47,585

about adoption foster care.

: 1222

01:01:47,585 --> 01:01:49,365

So I want to thank you.

: 1223

01:01:49,665 --> 01:01:53,655

From the deep depths of my heart

for you guys coming on a Black

: 1224

01:01:53,655 --> 01:01:58,185

Executive Perspective podcast, sharing

your journey, sharing your story,

: 1225

01:01:58,205 --> 01:02:01,195

educating our audience on this topic.

: 1226

01:02:01,335 --> 01:02:03,745

And I don't want you to go anywhere

else because you guys are going to

: 1227

01:02:03,755 --> 01:02:05,975

help us with our call to action.

: 1228

01:02:06,485 --> 01:02:11,065

So I think it's now

time for Tony's Tidbit.

: 1229

01:02:11,265 --> 01:02:11,565

All right.

: 1230

01:02:11,565 --> 01:02:13,255

So the tidbit today is this.

: 1231

01:02:13,945 --> 01:02:16,745

Every adoption story is a tale of turning.

: 1232

01:02:16,985 --> 01:02:23,585

Waiting into welcoming challenges into

cherishing while adopting one child

: 1233

01:02:23,585 --> 01:02:29,515

won't change the world for that child,

their entitled world will change.

: 1234

01:02:30,295 --> 01:02:34,935

And you heard a lot of that today

from our fabulous guests, so I

: 1235

01:02:34,935 --> 01:02:36,615

don't want you to forget this.

: 1236

01:02:36,750 --> 01:02:41,270

To always check out every

Thursday, need to know with Dr.

: 1237

01:02:41,270 --> 01:02:42,330

Nsenga Burton.

: 1238

01:02:42,550 --> 01:02:46,250

You don't want to miss it on the Black

Executive Perspective Podcast with Dr.

: 1239

01:02:46,250 --> 01:02:49,810

Burton dives into timely and

crucial topics that shape

: 1240

01:02:49,810 --> 01:02:51,160

our community and our world.

: 1241

01:02:51,480 --> 01:02:55,589

Tune in to gain unique insights and

deep understanding of the issues.

: 1242

01:02:55,590 --> 01:02:58,300

That matter every Thursday on

a black executive perspective

: 1243

01:02:58,620 --> 01:02:59,910

need to know with Dr.

: 1244

01:02:59,910 --> 01:03:00,650

Nsenga.

: 1245

01:03:00,820 --> 01:03:05,500

I hope you enjoyed today's episode,

becoming family, the challenges

: 1246

01:03:05,500 --> 01:03:07,630

and triumphs of adoptive parenting.

: 1247

01:03:07,950 --> 01:03:11,780

And so now it's time for

BEP's call to action.

: 1248

01:03:12,020 --> 01:03:12,800

Our goal.

: 1249

01:03:13,085 --> 01:03:18,285

is to decrease all forms of

discrimination, and we call that LESS.

: 1250

01:03:18,735 --> 01:03:24,765

L E S S and our esteemed guests are

going to help us with our call to action.

: 1251

01:03:24,765 --> 01:03:25,115

Aubree.

: 1252

01:03:25,705 --> 01:03:29,855

Aubree Henderson: So L is for learn

or educate yourself on racial and

: 1253

01:03:29,855 --> 01:03:33,925

cultural nuances and the shout out I

would give here is we've heard a lot

: 1254

01:03:33,925 --> 01:03:38,185

from the perspective of adoptive and

foster parents, um, which is awesome.

: 1255

01:03:38,540 --> 01:03:41,530

I would encourage folks who want to

learn more to seek out perspectives

: 1256

01:03:41,530 --> 01:03:45,770

from adoptees from people who have

been adopted, who have been through

: 1257

01:03:45,770 --> 01:03:47,520

that experience from that perspective.

: 1258

01:03:47,520 --> 01:03:48,720

There's there's lots out there.

: 1259

01:03:48,720 --> 01:03:49,580

If you just search.

: 1260

01:03:49,960 --> 01:03:51,340

adoptee perspective.

: 1261

01:03:51,770 --> 01:03:54,760

Um, you'll find a lot and

you know, sit with that.

: 1262

01:03:54,800 --> 01:03:58,730

It can be really challenging, but I

think that that is really helpful.

: 1263

01:03:59,490 --> 01:04:01,540

Laura Henderson: E is for empathy.

: 1264

01:04:01,780 --> 01:04:04,940

Empathy helps understand

diverse perspectives.

: 1265

01:04:04,990 --> 01:04:07,230

Empathy for me is about learning.

: 1266

01:04:07,775 --> 01:04:09,845

It's about imagination.

: 1267

01:04:10,095 --> 01:04:14,615

As we grow our ability to imagine

what it's like in somebody else's

: 1268

01:04:14,615 --> 01:04:19,945

shoes, we can be more kind, more

caring, create a more generous world.

: 1269

01:04:19,965 --> 01:04:21,815

So E is for empathy.

: 1270

01:04:22,625 --> 01:04:24,475

Dr. Nsenga Burton: S is

for share your insights.

: 1271

01:04:24,680 --> 01:04:26,090

And enlighten others.

: 1272

01:04:26,529 --> 01:04:32,020

So, I mean, you've heard this

podcast, um, you know, you've gotten

: 1273

01:04:32,040 --> 01:04:35,710

inside information that you may not

have had before you had access to.

: 1274

01:04:35,710 --> 01:04:37,470

So make sure you share it with people.

: 1275

01:04:37,760 --> 01:04:39,480

Make sure you share the positive.

: 1276

01:04:39,730 --> 01:04:41,810

And I know I came with some

of the negative, Tony, I

: 1277

01:04:41,810 --> 01:04:42,900

didn't mean to shake you up.

: 1278

01:04:42,900 --> 01:04:49,989

Tony Tidbit: But

: 1279

01:04:49,990 --> 01:04:52,430

Dr. Nsenga Burton: the reason is

because we share, we want to be

: 1280

01:04:52,430 --> 01:04:54,920

transparent and we want to make sure

that you have as much information.

: 1281

01:04:56,140 --> 01:04:59,130

In this limited amount of time,

um, to help you understand better,

: 1282

01:04:59,190 --> 01:05:03,970

understand foster care, fostering, uh,

uh, children and adopting children.

: 1283

01:05:04,750 --> 01:05:05,550

Tony Tidbit: Absolutely.

: 1284

01:05:05,550 --> 01:05:07,410

And then the final S is for stop.

: 1285

01:05:07,790 --> 01:05:10,850

You want to stop discrimination

as it walks in your path.

: 1286

01:05:11,070 --> 01:05:13,880

So if Aunt Jenny says something

at the Thanksgiving table, that's

: 1287

01:05:13,880 --> 01:05:16,150

inappropriate, you say Aunt Jenny.

: 1288

01:05:16,425 --> 01:05:20,775

We don't say that we don't believe

that and you stop it immediately.

: 1289

01:05:20,955 --> 01:05:24,765

So if everyone is listening to a

black executive perspective, podcast

: 1290

01:05:25,005 --> 01:05:28,495

can incorporate less L E S S.

: 1291

01:05:28,795 --> 01:05:32,665

We'll build a more fair and

more understanding world.

: 1292

01:05:32,904 --> 01:05:36,165

And more importantly, we'll

all be able to see the change.

: 1293

01:05:36,710 --> 01:05:40,650

That we want to see because

less will become more.

: 1294

01:05:41,060 --> 01:05:44,140

So remember to catch the next episode

of black executive perspective

: 1295

01:05:44,140 --> 01:05:47,090

podcast, wherever you get your podcast.

: 1296

01:05:47,090 --> 01:05:51,140

And you can follow us on our

socials of LinkedIn, YouTube,

: 1297

01:05:51,340 --> 01:05:53,910

X, Facebook, and Instagram.

: 1298

01:05:54,240 --> 01:05:57,840

At a black exec for

our fabulous guest, Dr.

: 1299

01:05:57,840 --> 01:06:02,480

Nsenga Burton for Lauren Aubree

Henderson, who came with the magic

: 1300

01:06:02,480 --> 01:06:04,830

and the love and the sharing today.

: 1301

01:06:05,040 --> 01:06:06,310

I'm Tony tidbit.

: 1302

01:06:06,550 --> 01:06:08,050

We learned about it today.

: 1303

01:06:08,050 --> 01:06:09,230

We talked about it.

: 1304

01:06:09,480 --> 01:06:10,470

I love you.

: 1305

01:06:10,650 --> 01:06:11,410

And guess what?

: 1306

01:06:11,540 --> 01:06:12,029

We're out

: 1307

01:06:16,510 --> 01:06:19,090

BEP Narrator: a black

executive perspective.